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China vows no Western-style political reformsAP March 10, 2011, 1:43 pm TWN    Wu Bangguo's comments were the latest emphatic rejection of any major political changes to accompany soaring economic growth, rising urbanization and an increasingly diversified society. Instead, Wu repeatedly emphasized in his address to the annual session of the National People's Congress the need to shore up party leadership and for government bodies to follow the party's directives in all areas. "On the basis of China's conditions, we have made a solemn declaration that we will not employ a system of multiple parties holding office in rotation," Wu told the nearly 3,000 delegates. Wu ruled out separating powers between the executive, legislative and judicial branches of government, adoption of a federal system, and said the division of parliament into upper and lower houses would also not be considered. China would not carry out formal privatization or "diversify our guiding thought," he said. He said while China wanted to strengthen its legal system, it would "never blindly follow or imitate others." "Different countries have different systems of laws, and we do not copy the systems of laws of certain Western countries when enacting the socialist system of laws with Chinese characteristics," Wu said. Wu's comments were a faint echo of ones he made 2009 in which he repeatedly blasted Western-style democracy and forcefully asserted China's rejection of such concepts. His remarks fueled speculation at the time over a possible debate within the party over the need for reform. The leadership has been deeply unsettled by the wave of anti-government protests across North Africa and the Middle East. Appeals of uncertain origin appearing on the Internet calling for a similar movement in China have met with a massive security crackdown.
66 Comments March 11, 2011 CURTISAKBAR@ China is scared of a popular protest, how many people do they need to kill to stop the protests? Just remember 1989.... March 11, 2011 hsiehmingyu@ If China will not adopt a multi-party styled democracy, my question is how can there ever be so-called "unification" with the 'Mainland' based on one-china principle? If it's ever "unified", KMT will be finished. I still feel that KMT should move towards establishing the Republic of Taiwan. March 12, 2011 lotiti@ .......you reminded me that those poor protesters who died in 1989 and reside under the ground never realized that their good friends who dwell above the ground enrich themselves from their dead.... March 13, 2011 cigars898@ The only way to topple the Chicoms is from within. March 16, 2011 victorlowt@ I disagree with "unification" is just a namesake...All you do need is protection for TAIWAN, enshrined in the constitution for "SPECIAL STATUS"... this special status should be registered @ the UNITED NATION, so that PROC cannot unilaterally revoke it. March 16, 2011 carltanong@ @cigars898The only way now to protect yourself from radiation is.....keep your MOUTH SHUT in the meantime. Otherwise you will EAT the radiation courtesy from Japan NUKE reactors radiation leak. This is time for you to pray for PEACE to all mankind and the Japanese peoples. NOT to SOW hatred, unrest with bloodshed to other's nation. It's time for all of us to help the Japanese peoples first. March 16, 2011 cigars898@ carltanong@Your statement is a contradiction. The truth will set the Chinese free. Which is why the Chicoms are so afraid of it. As are you. March 17, 2011 hsiehmingyu@ @victorlowt//I disagree with ...there is no need to establish a REPUBLIC of TAIWAN, because the current REPUBLIC OF CHINA is already a separate legal entity. But based on the "1992 consensus" between KMT and CCP, there is a tacit agreement that both side agree on a "One China" principle. What I'm getting at is.... if there is "One China" and CCP is adamant there won't be a multi-party styled democracy, where does this leave Taiwan? With the whole world now endorsing One China policy, does KMT want to convince CCP on a Two-China policy? What do you envisage for Taiwan? What is your ideal situation for Taiwan. I hope I'm not being rude, I'm genuinely trying to understand your standpoint and vision. March 18, 2011 victorlowt@ @hsiehmingyu...thx for your response.my vision is simple ( & perhaps even naive, but that's what a vision is=just a dream): 1// there will be a "FEDERATION of CHINA" (FOC) 2// the constitution of FOC (registered @the UNITED NATION) stipulates each entity of this FEDERATION is not only legal but also equal & free with its own political system. 3// that this FOC can (but not exclusive to) incorporate MAINLAND CHINA & TAIWAN (& potentially other parts of china) March 22, 2011 hsiehmingyu@ @victorlowtThat’s why a dream is called a dream :) I respect your vision. I see it differently... I base my opinion on having spent years in China doing business... understanding the political non-evolution etc. i genuinely feel that Taiwan would be better off being just Taiwan and move towards a revision of the constitution to embrace our multi-party political system that reflects our democratic values. That way, all political parties can work towards our country rather than constantly be at each other's throats on virtually all issues. That country in my vision is the Republic of Taiwan. I think and hope we can agree to disagree :) March 23, 2011 carltanong@ @hsiehmingyuSo, you are a businessman spending years in the mainland. So am I. Taiwan is Republic of China. Mainland is P.R.O.China Mr. Hsieh, when u are in the mainland doing business with our brothers and sisters I bet you will feel as a Chinese being at home while the mainlander likewise feel in Taiwan . So do I. U called yourself Taiwanese (Chinese). I called myself (Chinese) Chinoy when introducing myself to those mainlander Chinese businessmen. As both of us are on the same boat, we can see how great Taiwan n Mainland progressed. War will devastate both sides. Both sides have nothing to gained from War. Who will gain then? Just see for yourself. Iraq, Pakistan n Afghanistan, once a beautiful country. Now what? Lately, North Africa and the Gulf states are in chaos. Some big country said they want to give them the word Democracy (Jasmine). Actually, they wanted to get the wealth of those states. And their objective is OIL WEALTH. As a businessman, u and I should have the same VISION. That's Peace, Harmony and Prosperity for both sides. Do u believe those Dissidents and Activists love their country or just love a few hundred thousand $$$??? E.g. Look at Wang Dan and et al. Do they really believe what they believed or believed in $$$ and Corrupt ABIAN likewise. Is it true the Goddess of Democracy or the Goddess of Mercy KWAN YIN existed??? For Taiwan, it should be REPUBLIC OF CHINA NOT REPUBLIC OF TAIWAN. Otherwise we will LOSE Matsu, Kinmen, Penghu, Splatly and Diaoyutai. Because if anybody changed R.O.China to R.O.Taiwan, then it is only the main island named TAIWAN that belongs to R.O.Taiwan. Do NOT forget one thing. How our soldiers defend Kinmen and died for us. March 23, 2011 hsiehmingyu@ carltanong@ wrote: I’m sorry Carlton. The thing that really irritates me about your responses are that all you do is try and force feed info on people and unless they subscribe to your viewpoint, they are either 'Nipponese' or 'ashamed of their Chinese heritage'. I'm sure you don't like people ramming down their ideologies down you either. You're almost dictatorial in almost every one of your responses. Therefore, whilst I respect your political views, I honestly don't wish to engage / exchange with you at all. Respectfully.@hsiehmingyu So, you are a businessman spending years in the mainland. So am I. Taiwan is Republic of China. Mainland is P.R.O.China Mr. Hsieh, when u are in the mainland doing business with our brothers and sisters I bet you will feel as a Chinese being at home while the mainlander likewise feel in Taiwan . So do I. U called yourself Taiwanese (Chinese). I called myself (Chinese) Chinoy when introducing myself to those mainlander Chinese businessmen. As both of us are on the same boat, we can see how great Taiwan n Mainland progressed. War will devastate both sides. Both sides have nothing to gained from War. Who will gain then? Just see for yourself. Iraq, Pakistan n Afghanistan, once a beautiful country. Now what? Lately, North Africa and the Gulf states are in chaos. Some big country said they want to give them the word Democracy (Jasmine). Actually, they wanted to get the wealth of those states. And their objective is OIL WEALTH. As a businessman, u and I should have the same VISION. That's Peace, Harmony and Prosperity for both sides. Do u believe those Dissidents and Activists love their country or just love a few hundred thousand $$$??? E.g. Look at Wang Dan and et al. Do they really believe what they believed or believed in $$$ and Corrupt ABIAN likewise. Is it true the Goddess of Democracy or the Goddess of Mercy KWAN YIN existed??? For Taiwan, it should be REPUBLIC OF CHINA NOT REPUBLIC OF TAIWAN. Otherwise we will LOSE Matsu, Kinmen, Penghu, Splatly and Diaoyutai. Because if anybody changed R.O.China to R.O.Taiwan, then it is only the main island named TAIWAN that belongs to R.O.Taiwan. Do NOT forget one thing. How our soldiers defend Kinmen and died for us. March 24, 2011 edmund.ym.kwan@ Why would China adopt western democracy? Look at the West these days? They are in a mess. All you hear is arguments. Demoncrazy may be better than communism but can it compete with the system China is currently under? We will see in 20 years.But in any event, I cannot think of one reason why China will drop the system it has now and copy a soon-to-be-obsolete political system. Let the Americans preach their system. I love it when they are wrong! March 24, 2011 mtsai16@ @ edmund.ym.kwanThe US government is far from being an example of enlightened western democracy. At the same time, the Chinese should never believe that their current system should not be changed. Many Western European governments (and perhaps a Southeast Asian city-state?) do a better job than the US and China in promoting the well-being of their citizens. March 25, 2011 billythekid@ hsiehmingyu wrote about carltanong:"You're almost dictatorial in almost every one of your responses" 'almost'? Now, now, you don't want to hurt Carltanong's feelings. He really wants to hear "you're absolutely dictatorial", otherwise he keeps on believing he's too weak in his 'responses' due to his minority complex. March 25, 2011 poor.xs.commies@ @edmund.ym.kwanWhen commies start attacking, in a democratic country's newspaper, that which people all over the globe - and currently the Middle East - were willing to die for, then the writing must be on the wall for one-party states. They are feeling the heat, folks! China's one-party state (and suppression of people's personal freedom) is hanging on a single string: that of a booming economy; change that factor, and your one-party machine is next to fall. Be prepared to be "in a mess"! March 25, 2011 anotherdog58@ Edmund, you should distinguish between the people and the government when you write "China drop the system". The CCP will do everything to keep the system, but the people? A China in 20 years indeed could look very different, probably also because the CCP will not be able to control the people so much anymore! One reason why the people (not the CCP) might want to drop the system is that they request freedom to say and read what they want! Did you know, for example, that the other important Taiwanese newspaper, the Taipei Times, (no promotion intended) is blocked in the mainland?Where are you living - would you love to live in the PRC, which it seems you find superior? March 25, 2011 wang3%00@ "Why would China adopt western democracy?" -from edmund@The entity who wrote this doesn't live on this earth, apparently. Therefore, this is for you, dear Martian: Authoritarian governments of once non-democratic countries that are now democratic have never freely chosen to do so. They have done so from inside & outside pressure. There's your answer. (and you're welcome) March 25, 2011 curtisakbar@ Taiwan should never 'join' PROC as it has never been directly ruled by the mainland until 1945 and then only until 1947, During the Ch'ing dynasty the eastern part of Taiwan remained an Aborigine stronghold. It was only the Japanese that controlled and unified the whole island. The KMT just picked up the pieces. My Taiwanese family aren't Chinese and have nothing to do with China or want to do with China. So by saying Taiwan and China are brothers/sisters etc is not only historically incorrect but also offensive to the true native population of Taiwan the Aborigines. I believe the status quo of Taiwan isn't workable, as how can you claim to be a country when you only have a few embassies worldwide and only a handful of countries recognize your nationality. Taiwan should either seek independence or become a part of greater China in a confederated country. Where no capital, whether it's Taipei, Beijing, Lhasa etc is more important or dominant. Each region is equal and share the responsibility in regards to foreign affairs and international membership. I am not Taiwanese but can take an objective view of the situation. If China doesn't want democracy then under the confederation, that is their choice, but if the other members want multi-party democracy Beijing can't do anything to stop it. March 25, 2011 skylarjones@ The PRC's hold on power is currently based on it being able to deliver economic growth to its citizens. Should the PRC ever fall into a deep recession (as all economies eventually do), they may find their hold on power to be as brittle as thin ice; based on their over-reaction to the "Jasmine Revolutions", I think they are well aware of that fact. Which is probably also why they spend more on their internal security than their foreign defense.I think the best solution to the Cross Strait problem is a Greater Chinese Union that someone was touting some years ago that isn't spoken of anymore. The PRC gets to unite China, gets to keep its seat on the UN Security Council and the ROC gets full participation in the UN and keep its own army and neither gets to meddle in either's politics. If the PRC does democratize more, Tibet and Xinjiang can also be spun off like Taiwan but still be a member of the Greater China Union. March 25, 2011 skylarjones@ It always makes me laugh when the PRC denies anything Western, that they'll never adopt anything Western.Well, uh. Marx was a Westerner. Capitalism is Western; merchants were always at the bottom of Confucian social hierarchies. China is already Western. March 26, 2011 lotiti@ .....most of the commentators are being p**d for......just wanted to finish their job to.......China disintegration.....USSR was the victim of the word democracy....Yugoslavia disappeared from the world map....many countries were black-listed by a few elites businessman manipulating the White House. Who is the real president of .......and Communist Vietnam and India was temporary spared by.....HAHAHAHA March 27, 2011 edmund.ym.kwan@ anotherdog58@ wrote: I would say most of the Chinese are happy with the gov't. Of course, the west and some Taiwanese are more than happy to see it otherwise. The CCP are changing and improving as we speak. They are moving much faster than western countries. Sure there is always a chance that any party, let alone CCP, may not be able to control the people. Taiwan already lost control of the people. Look at Taiwan and Look at China. China makes Chinese proud and Taiwan does not.Edmund, you should distinguish between the people and the government when you write "China drop the system". The CCP will do everything to keep the system, but the people? A China in 20 years indeed could look very different, probably also because the CCP will not be able to control the people so much anymore! One reason why the people (not the CCP) might want to drop the system is that they request freedom to say and read what they want! Did you know, for example, that the other important Taiwanese newspaper, the Taipei Times, (no promotion intended) is blocked in the mainland? Where are you living - would you love to live in the PRC, which it seems you find superior? Of course I do not mind to live in PRC. Many American ex-pats love the same except there are enough openings. On the other hand, do I like to live in ROC - No! March 27, 2011 edmund.ym.kwan@ poor.xs.commies@ wrote: Many years from now, people will see that one-parties are just as good or better than multi-parties. Look at big companies. One CEO. Look at United Airline, where every worker is the boss. Unionized companies cannot compete against conventional companies where there is only ONE CEO.@edmund.ym.kwan When commies start attacking, in a democratic country's newspaper, that which people all over the globe - and currently the Middle East - were willing to die for, then the writing must be on the wall for one-party states. They are feeling the heat, folks! China's one-party state (and suppression of people's personal freedom) is hanging on a single string: that of a booming economy; change that factor, and your one-party machine is next to fall. Be prepared to be "in a mess"! China president is no dictator. Look at the transition from Zhang to Hu, is there a blood relationship? One party but a limited term is just as good as multiple parties. March 27, 2011 edmund.ym.kwan@ mtsai16@ wrote: mtsai16@ edmund.ym.kwan The US government is far from being an example of enlightened western democracy. At the same time, the Chinese should never believe that their current system should not be changed. Many Western European governments (and perhaps a Southeast Asian city-state?) do a better job than the US and China in promoting the well-being of their citizens. I never heard anyone, including the Chinese officials, say that China system cannot be changed. I have no idea where you come up with that. I would disagree that many western counties do better than China in terms of making improvements for their citizens. I would, however, agree that they did do better when China was in communism before 1972. After that, China is improving at a much greater speed then all the western counties combined. March 28, 2011 victorlazlo@ "One reason why the people (not the CCP) might want to drop the system is that they request freedom to say and read what they want"They read the People's Daily. The newspaper which shows the anti-budget cuts demonstration in London, zooms in on a single banner saying "No war in Libya" (carried by a Chinese?), and then headlines it "Europe protest against military intervention in Libya". Maybe another reason why Chinese people deserve democracy? March 29, 2011 anotherdog58@ Edmund, it is not only the communistic dictatorship which Wu Bangguo defends in the article above, he also (quotation) rules out separating powers between the executive, legislative and judicial branches of government, What is the effect of that? Example: Probably you heard about the Li Gang" incident - you can find details here:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Li_Gang_incident#cite_note-12 After driving people do death, the drunken driver said to the police: "Go ahead, sue me if you dare. My dad is Li Gang!" He could say that, because his father is deputy director of the local public security bureau, and as such has nearly unlimited power. I wonder: if your child would be driven to death by a son of a CCP leader without consequences - would you still prefer the PRC over the ROC? I dare to say: this kind of injustice cannot happen in the ROC. March 30, 2011 CURTISAKBAR@ skylarjones@ wrote: JUST LIKE WHAT I SAIDThe PRC's hold on power is currently based on it being able to deliver economic growth to its citizens. Should the PRC ever fall into a deep recession (as all economies eventually do), they may find their hold on power to be as brittle as thin ice; based on their over-reaction to the "Jasmine Revolutions", I think they are well aware of that fact. Which is probably also why they spend more on their internal security than their foreign defense. I think the best solution to the Cross Strait problem is a Greater Chinese Union that someone was touting some years ago that isn't spoken of anymore. The PRC gets to unite China, gets to keep its seat on the UN Security Council and the ROC gets full participation in the UN and keep its own army and neither gets to meddle in either's politics. If the PRC does democratize more, Tibet and Xinjiang can also be spun off like Taiwan but still be a member of the Greater China Union. April 5, 2011 Edmund.ym.kwan@ anotherdog58@ wrote: Li Gang's son is a drunk driver, as you stated. He does not represent China. If Li Gang son hit you, you can sue him in the Chinese court. The Chinese law never says you cannot sue Li Gang. Ha Ha. I do not know why you think Li Gang is the law of China - funny :)Edmund, it is not only the communistic dictatorship which Wu Bangguo defends in the article above, he also (quotation) rules out separating powers between the executive, legislative and judicial branches of government, What is the effect of that? Example: Probably you heard about the Li Gang" incident - you can find details here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Li_Gang_incident#cite_note-12 After driving people do death, the drunken driver said to the police: "Go ahead, sue me if you dare. My dad is Li Gang!" He could say that, because his father is deputy director of the local public security bureau, and as such has nearly unlimited power. I wonder: if your child would be driven to death by a son of a CCP leader without consequences - would you still prefer the PRC over the ROC? I dare to say: this kind of injustice cannot happen in the ROC. btw, who the heck is Li Gang? Do you know him? I’m sure not. If a drunk driver says to you sue me my dad is a big lawyer, do you have 5 millions for legal fees, does it mean you will leave the US and move back to China? Well, I suppose you relocate every 3 months and hope you find an ideal country. April 5, 2011 Edmund.ym.kwan@ victorlazlo@ wrote: They read the People's Daily. The newspaper which shows the anti-budget cuts demonstration in London, zooms in on a single banner saying "No war in Libya" (carried by a Chinese?), and then headlines it "Europe protest against military intervention in Libya". Maybe another reason why Chinese people deserve democracy?"One reason why the people (not the CCP) might want to drop the system is that they request freedom to say and read what they want" They read the People's Daily. The newspaper which shows the anti-budget cuts demonstration in London, zooms in on a single banner saying "No war in Libya" (carried by a Chinese?), and then headlines it "Europe protest against military intervention in Libya". Maybe another reason why Chinese people deserve democracy? You are a funny guy. When you read Chinese newspaper, of course you will see violet foreigners. If you wish to see violet Chinese, you have to read Washington Post. BTW, I believe they just went bankrupt. Anyway, Washington Post will show a picture of a Chinese man beating up and cheating on his wife where a white man will go save her. That is what sells a newspaper. In the West, anything that can generate revenue is a good business. Make sure you understand how the media business works. If you wish to read someone bad mouthing Chinese gov't, then read the newspaper in the West, otherwise, read it in the East - please do not co-mingle the two - you funny guy! April 7, 2011 victorlazlo@ @Emund.ym.kwanWhy then are you reading this newspaper? It's from a democratic country and does criticize the CCP by publishing articles from Western news sources (Reuters, AP) - like today's article on Ai WeiWei. That's "bad" as you call it, no? p.s. I never read American newspapers + I read what I want, not what a commie wants me to read. April 7, 2011 johnnywang@ edmund.redchina.kwan wrote (27 March)"I would say most of the Chinese are happy with the gov't." "I never heard anyone, including the Chinese officials, say that China system cannot be changed." "Sure there is always a chance that any party, let alone CCP, may not be able to control the people." It's YOU who's reading and commenting in the wrong newspaper, pal. This newspaper is for those who want to find out more and not for the likes of you who pretend to know it all but are actually narrow-minded and uninformed. April 7, 2011 peace4all@ I agree with Edmund.kwai!"Westerners", let's not read Chinese newspapers. Europeans, Australians etc.: read the Washington Post (the only 'western' paper Edmund knows about - from the Chinese media, of course). "Chinese" folks, read red propaganda tabloids only. That way, we will never understand each other, antagonize each other par excellence, and go to war with each other in a decade or so. Edmund will be happy watching it all unfold and say "I told you so". April 7, 2011 billythekid@ edmund.ym.kwai says :If you wish to read someone bad mouthing Chinese gov't, then read the newspaper in the West, otherwise, read it in the East - please do not co-mingle the two - you funny guy!Excuse me for pointing this out, but that's exactly what you are doing in this forum, isn't it? April 8, 2011 anotherdog58@ Edmund, you know exactly that being a big lawyer with millions is not sufficient to get out of jail. But having the judge and the police and the lawmakers not independent, then it is possible. And that's what it is in China, and, even worse, claimed to be good by Wu Bangguo. And that what makes Taiwan's democratic system so superior to the ruling of the CCP.No, I would not move away from China, but that does not mean that I support this corrupt system. The CCP manages very successfully to make any critics look like a critics on the economic success of China. Just read China Daily and see about the brainwashing of their own people, for example on the things happening in Libya. And that was Victorlazlo's comment, not the incorrect information, but the manipulated information. About Relocating: it is funny that the biggest CCP supporters, which are not CCP members themselves, are usually Oversea Chinese, who on the other hand, are not willing to relocate back to their “promised land”. They just want to polish their nationalism, dreaming of a “Greater China”. April 9, 2011 edmund.ym.kwan@ anotherdog58@ wrote: In China, the money will go to the corrupted judge. Yes, I agree. In America, the money will go to the lawyers. The money always go somewhere, isn't it? Well, you may say it is worst when to see money going to the corrupted judge, but on the other hand, it is a bidding war on both sides. Just like in the US, the lawyers laugh all the way to the bank. There are corrupted lawyers all over. How many dishonest lawyers ever get lock up? They wrote the law such that during the trial, they need not be under oath.Edmund, you know exactly that being a big lawyer with millions is not sufficient to get out of jail. But having the judge and the police and the lawmakers not independent, then it is possible. And that's what it is in China, and, even worse, claimed to be good by Wu Bangguo. And that what makes Taiwan's democratic system so superior to the ruling of the CCP. No, I would not move away from China, but that does not mean that I support this corrupt system. The CCP manages very successfully to make any critics look like a critics on the economic success of China. Just read China Daily and see about the brainwashing of their own people, for example on the things happening in Libya. And that was Victorlazlo's comment, not the incorrect information, but the manipulated information. About Relocating: it is funny that the biggest CCP supporters, which are not CCP members themselves, are usually Oversea Chinese, who on the other hand, are not willing to relocate back to their “promised land”. They just want to polish their nationalism, dreaming of a “Greater China”. Have you ever take any to trial in the US? Try to take a corporation to the US, you will see they you are fighting with army of blood sucking lawyers, these lawyers charge $800 per hours and they work 120 hour per week and 30 hours a day. Do you really think the US legal system is a better system? Come on. China should not adapt the US legal system. Of course China should curb corruption too but the western legal system provides little justice. Can anyone explain when a western lawyer can earn millions by representing someone hit by a car? What did they do? April 11, 2011 edmund.ym.kwan@ billythekid@ wrote: billythekid@edmund.ym.kwai says :If you wish to read someone bad mouthing Chinese gov't, then read the newspaper in the West, otherwise, read it in the East - please do not co-mingle the two - you funny guy! Excuse me for pointing this out, but that's exactly what you are doing in this forum, isn't it? I read news from both sides to ensure an open mind. I must admit that 15 years ago, if you read news from both sides, Western news will capture ones mind since they have huge budget. Chinese media has come a long way but still behind. The game is much more even now but the West still has a big lead in terms of budget. Today, no one can cover up the Internet. Even one-sided news media like Fox News and CNN failed to seal the truth and anyone can find ways to come to their own conclusion. That is just the way I like it. It is time to end the western media domination. April 11, 2011 edmund.ym.kwan@ anotherdog58@ wrote: Edmund, you know exactly that being a big lawyer with millions is not sufficient to get out of jail. But having the judge and the police and the lawmakers not independent, then it is possible. And that's what it is in China, and, even worse, claimed to be good by Wu Bangguo. And that what makes Taiwan's democratic system so superior to the ruling of the CCP. No, I would not move away from China, but that does not mean that I support this corrupt system. The CCP manages very successfully to make any critics look like a critics on the economic success of China. Just read China Daily and see about the brainwashing of their own people, for example on the things happening in Libya. And that was Victorlazlo's comment, not the incorrect information, but the manipulated information. About Relocating: it is funny that the biggest CCP supporters, which are not CCP members themselves, are usually Oversea Chinese, who on the other hand, are not willing to relocate back to their “promised land”. They just want to polish their nationalism, dreaming of a “Greater China”. Anotherdog, being able to hire savvy lawyers who lie lawfully is sufficient to stay out the jail to begin with. Do you know who OJ Simpson is? Probably not. April 13, 2011 anotherdog58@ Edmund, I respect your opinion as you wrote you are living in the PRC. I never lived in the U.S. but I am living in Taiwan. That money is influencing the justice is true to some extent, but the much worse situation is, when the lawmaker is the same as the judge and the jailor. If this horrible situation ever would come to Taiwan (unification), I would not move away, but I definitely would not appreciate it.Are you sure that in China the money would go to a corrupt judge and not to a corrupt CCP member? And, is there an upper class above the law, called CCP and everyone who sees and marks that the emperors has no clothes goes to jail (especially recently!) ? April 14, 2011 Edmund.ym.kwan@ anotherdog58@ wrote: Are you sure that in China the money would go to a corrupt judge and not to a corrupt CCP member?Edmund, I respect your opinion as you wrote you are living in the PRC. I never lived in the U.S. but I am living in Taiwan. That money is influencing the justice is true to some extent, but the much worse situation is, when the lawmaker is the same as the judge and the jailor. If this horrible situation ever would come to Taiwan (unification), I would not move away, but I definitely would not appreciate it. Are you sure that in China the money would go to a corrupt judge and not to a corrupt CCP member? And, is there an upper class above the law, called CCP and everyone who sees and marks that the emperors has no clothes goes to jail (especially recently!) ? No one can be sure where the corrupted money would go as in any system? I am a US citizen but have lived in Taiwan and China for many years. Taiwan adopted the legal system in the West so it has both corrupted judges and lawyers. China has mostly corrupted judges and US has heap of corrupted lawyers, who would turn into law makers and politicians. In China and Taiwan, corruption is illegal but in the US, corrupted lawyers are common but considered as lawful. Corrupted lawyers in the US talk proudly as if they represent justice. In Asia, if a buyer takes money, it is called illegal kickback. In the US, it is called legitimate rebate. When a judge in Asia makes a sinful decision, he is viewed as suspicious. In the US, if a lawyer can prevent a criminal from being prosecuted, he is viewed as savvy. They are all corrupted differently but they do have one thing in common. If you are wealth, you are likely to be above the law in most places. I am not here to defend for China. However, if anyone suggesting that China should adopt the legal system of the West, he is obviously being brain washed by the powerful western media. As with most Americans, who have no idea that they have tunnel vision. April 16, 2011 teknikal_pan@ Dear Edmund Kwan,You are right about OJ. I have lived in Taiwan and now live in the mainland and I can say that each place has its virtues and drawbacks. Ostensibly, the PRC is more lawless but Taipei has a more visible mob presence compared to Shanghai. Once in Taipei, about 5 years ago, I witnessed a drunken fight outside of a night club. A western man whom I knew punched a Taiwanese girl in the face and broke her jaw. It turned out that the girl's father was a powerful gangster. At this point, the police showed up and took them down to the local station. Then a group of gangsters showed up and demanded a large sum of money from the western man while threatening him with bodily harm. They beat him up a bit and harassed him for more than 6 hours in the station while the police looked on. The police said they couldn't do anything about it. Taiwan can be a lawless place. It just has a more open political system than mainland China. April 18, 2011 johnnybgood@ <Meaning that in Taiwan sometimes cowards get beaten up the mob by for the police and public to witness, while in China, innocent people regularly get beaten up by the police themselves? Is that "just" the difference you refer to, teknikal? What do you think would have happened to that man "you knew" were this to have happened in Shanghai? April 18, 2011 billythekid@ teknikal_pan:What a silly contribution to this discussion! Something you happened to once witness 5 years ago can hardly be used for any generalization about Taiwan. Have you perhaps been given the opportunity to also visit precincts in China to see how they handle similar situations? Ignorance is no excuse for speaking out unknowingly. April 19, 2011 lotiti@ ....China will never adopt western style.....because China won't allow the lawless elements to....China won't allow the PLA to bomb foreign civilians and....China have no intention to occupied and possess foreign wealth through force....China never give ultimatum or threatening any head of states to step down and....and China...will never allow the PLA to sleep in the body bag....HAHAHA. April 19, 2011 attaaa!@ @lotiti (aka HAHAHA)For your sake, let's hope China won't lock up the mentally challenged either! April 20, 2011 skylarjones@ lotti:China has been doing everything you just mentioned for centuries. They're not going to change now. April 23, 2011 skyestefani@ Some comments above say that China will never adopt Western-style political reforms. But then why is China, and why are those people so afraid of such reforms? Because many people in China secretly envy the West? Why are some replies above so adamant in their hatred of the West? After all, if all Chinese are united in their rejection of Western democracy, surely there's nothing to be so adamant about?! Do we ever see headlines the likes of "Western countries will never adopt Communist reforms"? And why not? Because it's authoritarianism that's under pressure of reform here. And there are basically only two systems: democracy & one-party rule. The one has been and still is rising, the other is slowly but surely dying a sometimes violent death. Whether or not China's one-party rule will be next to fall is for all people living on China's soil to decide, not just those people assembling in the 'great hall of the people' once a year. And definitely not by the few hardline communists commenting above. April 25, 2011 edmund.ym.kwan@ skyestefani@ wrote: Some comments above say that China will never adopt Western-style political reforms. But then why is China, and why are those people so afraid of such reforms? Because many people in China secretly envy the West? Why are some replies above so adamant in their hatred of the West? After all, if all Chinese are united in their rejection of Western democracy, surely there's nothing to be so adamant about?! Do we ever see headlines the likes of "Western countries will never adopt Communist reforms"? And why not? Because it's authoritarianism that's under pressure of reform here. And there are basically only two systems: democracy & one-party rule. The one has been and still is rising, the other is slowly but surely dying a sometimes violent death. Whether or not China's one-party rule will be next to fall is for all people living on China's soil to decide, not just those people assembling in the 'great hall of the people' once a year. And definitely not by the few hardline communists commenting above. The only reason you called it a reform is because you feel that China should adopt Western style democracy. We do not consider it a reform. We consider it a backward movement. This should take care of the rest of your paragraph as it was solely built on your faulty belief. You never see headlines of Western-style will never adopt communist reform is because the west is the only country asking others to adopt their system - they call it a reform - a one-sided terminology. All the people in China to decide China has always been the case. History shows that gov't who cannot lead will be toppled. That does not mean that China will adopt to Western-style democracy - where each person has an opinion and most do not know what they are talking about. The recent US poll shows that most Americans want more gov't service, most people do not believe in raising tax. Most employees in the company want more salary and less work hours too - go figure! April 30, 2011 skyestefani@ edmund.ym....:"because the west is the only country asking others to adopt their system" The world counts 192 countries. 132 of those are democratic. According to an earlier post of you here, 132 countries in the world are, and I quote you, "in a mess"? Also according to you: "The CCP are changing and improving as we speak" (27 March). You call it "improving". Others call it "reform". What's the difference? But at least you admit that not all is well in China. And please stop moaning about the US in your comments. Democracy is the right of all people to choose their leaders. And if those leaders make "a mess" as you like to call it, the people will have the right to choose new leaders. That might be chaotic, but it's fair. And as you might have guessed, I'm not American. Neither am I a "fan" of US imperialism; only one belief/practice is worst than that: yours. May 1, 2011 peace4all@ Edmund,Find yourself a non-democratic newspaper to leave your comments: People's Daily, for instance? I know that will be hard, since those papers filter or don't allow comments. This paper is from a democratic country written for democratic people. Oh dear, did I use the word DEMOCRATIC too many times for your taste? Sorry about that... . Maybe have a pint of Tsingtao? Your national beer founded by a brewery from the West. My my... May 5, 2011 edmund.ym.kwan@ Skyestefani,Yes there may be 132 countries that are practicing democracy but not everyone has a big mouth. You mentioned headlines - right? If you indicated clearly that you actually meant the number of democratic countries, then you have to make yourself clear. Improving and reform are different and non parallel - please go look up the dictionary. Peace4all, Do you know the meaning of democracy? It is referred to countries, not papers. There are papers in a democratic country that do not allow comments and there are papers in China that allow comments - Get it? May 6, 2011 skyestefani@ edmund.ym...:"Improving and reform are different and non parallel" You didn't even check the definition of 'reform' before replying. As for the 'big mouth' (US, I presume), I start to understand that this shoe would fit you quite well, also. May 7, 2011 lotiti@ ...The USA is the only country...hah...loves to lecture the world about freedom, democracy and human rights...it is the only and only one evil empire that has masterminded to invade other countries in order to manipulate the world...and of course the USA contradicted democracy and freedom they preached but never practiced...and millions of innocent foreign civilians died including her own American citizens. May 7, 2011 Peace4all@ Edmund,"There are papers in a democratic country that do not allow comments and there are papers in China that allow comments - Get it?" That's what I wrote in my comment, so you don't get it. Let me enlighten you: "The President of Taiwan is an idiot" No he isn't, and I support him for defending Taiwan's DEMOCRATIC PRESS. But now you write the same words about your idol Hu Jintao in a Chinese newspaper. Let's see whether or not your comment will be filtered - and what will happen to you if you do so. Get it? May 8, 2011 hsueric01@ The argument in China's policy-making where reform is concerned is ‘how much more authoritarian should we be?’ and not ‘how do we embark on Western-style democracy?’ And despite the balance of world power favoring China, that tighter grip is actually a sign of China's weakening hand. May 9, 2011 marcborsati@ Some good Chinese folks above do not seem to understand something: WE LIVE IN A POST-AMERICAN AGE. America-bashing is outdated since Americans are speedily losing their grip on world power. We are and will all be dominated by a trio of superpowers: the US, China, and Europe. Your mindset (e.g. lotiti, edmund, teknikal) about the new world order is therefore equally outdated. Reading your comments here is like reading old Maoist propaganda. If China wants to grasp the opportunity to become an equal power to the US or Europe (and it can!), let it first get rid of its minority complexes towards Westerners - as witnessed by some comments above. He who controls others may be powerful, but he who has mastered himself is mightier still. Judging from this forum, some Chinese still have to work hard on this. May 9, 2011 samuelwelsh400@ China's ignorance will be its downfall. May 10, 2011 edmund.ym.kwan@ Peace4all@ wrote: <"The President of Taiwan is an idiot"Edmund, "There are papers in a democratic country that do not allow comments and there are papers in China that allow comments - Get it?" That's what I wrote in my comment, so you don't get it. Let me enlighten you: "The President of Taiwan is an idiot" No he isn't, and I support him for defending Taiwan's DEMOCRATIC PRESS. But now you write the same words about your idol Hu Jintao in a Chinese newspaper. Let's see whether or not your comment will be filtered - and what will happen to you if you do so. Get it? No he isn't, and I support him for defending Taiwan's DEMOCRATIC PRESS. But now you write the same words about your idol Hu Jintao in a Chinese newspaper. Let's see whether or not your comment will be filtered - and what will happen to you if you do so. Get it?> Ask anyone who is not a citizen of Taiwan and China to judge which government is more efficient and productive, I can assure you no one will pick Taiwan unless he is with a political agenda. No one compares China and Taiwan any more, Taiwan is not in that league. Taiwan will soon be compared with Malaysia. May 10, 2011 yuist666@ Mister Edmund Wank, what’s wrong with Malaysia??? Malaysia’ GDP per person is double that of China’s!!! And Taiwan at almost 10X. Sorry... me happy in happy bad Taiwan, me go to China!!! You funny man!!! Sorry my English is bad. Me not live in English speaking country like you. May 14, 2011 edmund.ym.kwan@ yuist666@ wrote: yuist666Mister Edmund Wank, what’s wrong with Malaysia??? Malaysia’ GDP per person is double that of China’s!!! And Taiwan at almost 10X. Sorry... me happy in happy bad Taiwan, me go to China!!! You funny man!!! Sorry my English is bad. Me not live in English speaking country like you. US politicians admit that China is a superpower. 21 years ago before Taiwan copied US democracy, or I say they tried to copy, its GNP was about 40-60x that of China. Today, it is about 5x. Gee, how 1.3 billion people caught up to 21 million. Taiwanese is still an ultra power since it has GNP 5x of a superpower! I bet you did not know that you are living in an ultra power. Surprised! Happy now! May 16, 2011 grahambell@ Edmund,China has many political and internal corruption issues that are going to come to a head, along with a labor market that will begin to demand more rights and benefits as money flows into the country. The only issue is that everything is so interconnected now that if they fall they will most likely take the rest of the world with them economically and on a scale that is much worse than anything now. And btw, your comparison of a country of 23 (not 21) million people and one with over a billion is adolescent behavior, at best. May 26, 2011 csgant@ mtsai16@ wrote: When the KMT tried to enforce a cigarette tax on a street vendor, history will tell you what happened. If all the people aren't represented (how can they be with just one party?), you will have a major upheaval in the future. Really, China is a powder keg that could explode anytime at the smallest incident. Democracy is imperfect. Communism is flawed.@ edmund.ym.kwan The US government is far from being an example of enlightened western democracy. At the same time, the Chinese should never believe that their current system should not be changed. Many Western European governments (and perhaps a Southeast Asian city-state?) do a better job than the US and China in promoting the well-being of their citizens. June 6, 2011 edmund.ym.kwan@ grahambell@ wrote: Are you suggesting that China is the only country that has problem? That’s new!Edmund, China has many political and internal corruption issues that are going to come to a head, along with a labor market that will begin to demand more rights and benefits as money flows into the country. The only issue is that everything is so interconnected now that if they fall they will most likely take the rest of the world with them economically and on a scale that is much worse than anything now. And btw, your comparison of a country of 23 (not 21) million people and one with over a billion is adolescent behavior, at best. Your remarks are without any substance, so that makes you elementary school level, at best. June 24, 2011 grahambell@ Edmund,No need to become so aggressively defensive. No, I did not suggest that China is the only country having that problem. Where did you read this in my comment? Obviously, my elementary comment level is still too high for you. And about the "no substance" part: you're joking, surely. Because otherwise most of the newspapers, western and Asian, are writing the same thing "without substance". June 25, 2011 skyestefani@ Edmund.ym.kwan:Dear Mr. K. Wank, You’re obviously outnumbered in this "online discussion" on defending China. The world tries to accept China. The world does not love China. Extreme views like yours -- insulting other countries like Taiwan and Malaysia -- will not help accepting China. The name of this newspaper is China Post. But it does not represent dictatorial views like yours. You shame all moderate Chinese. |
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I don’t see the current one party autocracy in CHINA reflecting that, especially at the local level...the party members seem to be using their 'exclusive' power to benefit themselves, oblivious to the plight of ordinary citizens.